So I know that this is an ancient conversation that I already participated in, but recent events at Occupy Congress (which I was at) and some of the bad stuff that has gone down at Occupy Oakland (which I have never been to) made me think of something pertinent that I hadn't before.
I'm sure there are exceptions, but in general, misguided overzealous assholes who want to do bad shit, just do it. The people in Oakland who throw bottles at cops and vandalize things just do that - they throw bottles and vandalize (apparently they usually also do it from the back of crowds, meaning that the peaceful people in the front who have done nothing wrong take the force of the angry police response in a city where police brutality against Occupy has been horrific, and I find that even more reprehensible than the actions that they're doing in the first place, but that's a different matter). They don't bother inciting. Inciting is, by and large, provocateur behavior.
If the "let's lock the MBTA door" guy was for real, I'd expect him to just do it, probably with a few friends. I mean, for one thing, that's way less conspicuous and likely to be noticed by the police, in a big crowd of peaceful people, than a whole mob going over and doing it. But instead he tried to incite a mob. I saw some of this kind of incitement at Occupy Congress (an event where I would have been astounded if there weren't any provocateurs, and which I thought was by its nature vulnerable to provocateurs or other instigators) earlier this week. It made me think about the issue, which made me remember this conversation.
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ninetydegrees
no subject
on 21 Jan 2012 16:59 (UTC)I'm sure there are exceptions, but in general, misguided overzealous assholes who want to do bad shit, just do it. The people in Oakland who throw bottles at cops and vandalize things just do that - they throw bottles and vandalize (apparently they usually also do it from the back of crowds, meaning that the peaceful people in the front who have done nothing wrong take the force of the angry police response in a city where police brutality against Occupy has been horrific, and I find that even more reprehensible than the actions that they're doing in the first place, but that's a different matter). They don't bother inciting. Inciting is, by and large, provocateur behavior.
If the "let's lock the MBTA door" guy was for real, I'd expect him to just do it, probably with a few friends. I mean, for one thing, that's way less conspicuous and likely to be noticed by the police, in a big crowd of peaceful people, than a whole mob going over and doing it. But instead he tried to incite a mob. I saw some of this kind of incitement at Occupy Congress (an event where I would have been astounded if there weren't any provocateurs, and which I thought was by its nature vulnerable to provocateurs or other instigators) earlier this week. It made me think about the issue, which made me remember this conversation.